ATFAQ198 – Q1. Video Modeling Apps, Q2. AT for Cooking, Q3. AT for Learning Disabilities, Q4. AI Tools for Dyslexia, Q5. Wildcard: Everyday products that should be marketed as AT

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Welcome to ATFAQ Assistive Technology Frequently Asked Questions, with your host, Brian Norton, director of Assistive Technology at Easterseals Crossroads. This is a show where we address your questions about assistive technology, the hardware, software, tools, and gadgets that help people with disabilities lead more independent and fulfilling lives. Have a question you’d like to answer it on our show, send us a tweet with the hashtag ATFAQ. Call our listener line at 317-721-7124 or send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org. The world of assistive technology has questions and we have answers. And now, let’s jump into today’s show.

Hello and welcome to ATFAQ, Episode 198. My name is Brian Norton. I’m the host of the show, and we’re so happy that you’ve taken some time to tune in with us this week. We’ve got a great lineup of assistive technology questions for you today. Before we jump in, I want to take a moment to go around our virtual room and introduce Josh and Belva, who are with me today for our show. So we’ll start with Belva. Belva is the team lead for our vision and sensory team here at Easterseals Crossroads. Belva, you want to say hi?

Hi, everybody.

Excellent. And then we also have Josh, he’s the popular host of AT Update, but also the director of our assistive technology program. Josh, do you want to say hi?

Hi, everybody. Welcome back. Or if your first time, welcome first.

Excellent, excellent. Yeah, if it is your first time, just a couple of notes about how our show works, and how we put this show together. So we come across feedback, and across various assistive technology questions throughout the week. We try to take all of that, we try to put that into a show, great ways to be able to get us your questions. Questions, you can send it to our listener line, that’s 317-721-7124. Send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org, or send us a tweet with the hashtag, #ATFAQ. All great ways to get your questions to us, but also as we try to answer the questions for today’s show, we also realize we don’t have all the answers. So, we want to give you an opportunity to chime in if you have maybe a different take on the question, or have some additional types of adaptive technology, assistive technology that you’d like to throw out there, as possible solutions.

And so you can get us your feedback in the very same ways that you can get us your questions. Again, that listener line, 317-721-7124, email tech@eastersealscrossroads.org, or through Twitter with the hashtag #ATFAQ.

Without further ado, I’m going to jump into our first question today. The first question is, “What video modeling apps are available to help teach skills to individuals with disabilities?: I’m looking for apps that allow you to create or use videos to model tasks or behaviors.” So, as we jump into this question, I thought it might be a little bit helpful for folks who aren’t familiar with what video modeling is, to actually just mention what it is. And so essentially what this is, is it really does allow you, it’s basically just taking a video of someone performing a task, so that a person with a disability can be able to watch that person perform that task, understands the steps of that task. So let’s say it’s making coffee or filling the dishwasher, you can break that down into simple, easy to understand tasks, record a video and chop it up into those sections, helping that person be able to understand how to move from step one to step two to step three, all the way to completion.

And so it’s super helpful for a lot of folks just to be able to see it, and then repeat what they see. And so, that would be kind of a very layman’s broken down description of what video modeling is. So, I just want to throw that out.

And there’s quite a few different ones out there and they all have pluses and minuses. One, I know that a lot of folks like is one called CanPlan. Now it’s not really video modeling, it’s picture based. So you take a picture, but like Brian said, you can break things down step by step, and you can actually use your own pictures. So if you’re trying to learn how to use the dryer, you could take a picture of the controls, take a picture of someone pushing the button, turning the dial, putting the clothes in, putting the fabric sheet, cleaning out the thing that traps lint, the lint trap, I guess that’s a good name for it. But you can take a picture of each one of those steps, and even make a checklist almost to go down.

So it’s not quite video modeling, it’s a little bit more picture based, but as far as the video modeling, Brian, do you have a favorite one, or one that you really like, or really use or anything? Some of them, I’m noticing, this sounds terrible, but some of them can be really expensive to really use, or even a little bit difficult to put together. So I don’t know if I really have a favorite one.

I’ve used a few different options in the past, or I’ve not necessarily used them, but I’ve shared about those in my presentations. So a few of them are Model Me Kids. Model Me Kids has a library of, I think it’s around 200 video modeling lessons. And they actually teach social and behavioral skills. And so, that would be one I would have folks look up. It’s called Model Me Kids. One I have used with a client in the past is called iModeling. And basically, that allows you to create personalized video models. You can record different tasks or behaviors, and then use those as teaching tools with folks.

And so to your point, Josh, a little bit like what you said with CanPlan, breaks it down, little video snippets, break down tasks into individual steps, until that task is complete. Another one, if you’re interested to learn a little bit more about video modeling, I think there’s an app called How to ABA and that can provide some resources and guidance on actually using video modeling, help give you some tips and tricks about how to use it, and how to work that into someone’s schedule. It might be helpful to be able to again, get the background, understand a little bit more.

Really, video modeling is all about visual learning. And so, if someone’s better at visual learning instead of being just simply told to do this, that, or the other, you can simply watch those things. And so, How to ABA will help with some different resources and guidance around that.

And so what I found is, I was trying to research this, because this is not something that I’ve ever used. Now, I’ve done plenty of the step-by-step how to do something, but never really in a video. But what I learned is when you try to Google video modeling, you get all kinds of crazy results. So you do have to be careful. But I’m curious what makes… Because I did learn that some of the apps are very inexpensive, and some are expensive, but what makes the apps any better than just using your phone or something, to make your own step by step recording? Is there special features with the apps that make them flow together better?

I think the apps are set up so that you don’t have to do the video editing piece of it. It actually helps you segment that video into short little snippets, and then basically sews those all together into a continuous task, different steps. So, sequencing your…

And I noticed this individual was asking about being able to incorporate videos into some of them. So I would assume that the apps probably do allow you to incorporate different learning materials.

Yeah, there’s a few out there that’ll actually include different videos on learning how to clean, cook, eat, do your laundry, personal hygiene. All of those are types of things that I see people use video modeling a lot for. I’ve used it on the job with some of the clients that we’ve worked with before on basically how to use this industrial dishwasher.

So the person could actually scan a QR code, and that QR code would lead them to a video modeling example of, “Hey, here comes the dirty dishes and this is how you fill the racks, and this is how you send it through the dishwasher, and when it’s done, here’s some important things to be able to think about as you pull it from the hot water, and put those things away,” and those kinds of things. And so it was really helpful for the client that I was working for in that particular situation.

I will throw out just two other real quick ones that I’ve heard about. inPromptu is another free app. And again, it has those pre-made video prompts that cover quite a bit of different categories, some of the ones I mentioned earlier. So in inPromptu. Then there’s one called Avaz AAC, and it incorporates video modeling to help teach some communication skills. And so, something to keep in mind if you’re trying to think about communication skills as they relate to behaviors, might be helpful to look at a little bit as well. Avaz AAC.

Well, hey, I’d love to open this up to our listeners if you guys have any feedback on this particular question, thinking about video modeling, different tools that you’ve used before, or situations where you found it to be helpful, love to hear from you. You can give us a call on our listener line that’s 317-721-7124, or send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org.

All right, so our next question is, “What assistive technology can help people with physical disabilities cook and eat independently?”

Well, there’s a lot of these kind of things out there. Some of them are the As Seen on TV devices, you think like the HandiChop. I’m not going to lie, it’s probably not as good as if you’re really good with a knife, but seriously, you just tap on the thing, and it chops up all your vegetables for you. So that could be helpful, just because it does say, “Physical disabilities” on here. So there’s a lot of different ones.

There’s a lot of things out there to hold stuff. So, I’ve worked with a lot of folks in the past who maybe only have use of one arm, or only a lot of strength maybe on one side, due to a stroke or any other kind of disability. So there’s cutting boards that usually have little almost pins sticking out of them. So you can easily stick the onion, or potato, or something, right on there. So you can just use one hand. There’s cutting boards where the knife is actually attached to the cutting board.

Sometimes there’s ones that have all these different kind of pieces put together. There’s small devices you can put on the stove that’ll hold the pot steady for you, without catching fire. You could always use a towel, but that’s a really bad idea, but it’ll hold the pot steady so you can stir it. There’s just so many different things. If you go to Maxiaids or LS&S products, you go to these places, just look up cooking, they’re going to have tons of things. What you’ll also notice whenever you go there is, you’ll also see a lot of things that are very commonplace. So, a slow cooker. I throw everything in a slow cooker, I turn one dial, I don’t have to do anything. I don’t have an Instapot or an air fryer, but these things are the same.

There’s also the Brava Oven, which is made for really anybody to use, but you put your food in there, you push a few buttons and it does all the work for you, and you don’t really have to do a whole heck of a lot.

Also, there’s a lot of different things with different kinds of handles, different kinds of grips to allow you to use cooking utensils, eating utensils, things like that. As far as eating, oh, I forgot the name of one of them. Darn it. But anyway, there’s other kinds of devices out there that can really help you with eating and everything. And then also smart home devices. There’s ovens, refrigerators, microwaves, all these different things that can be connected to your smart home assistant whose name I won’t say because Belva is on here, and no matter which one I say, your house will start talking to me or I’ll turn off her thermostat or something.

But you can connect these to stuff, so you can actually say, “Preheat the oven to this temperature, cook for this long, set this.” So there’s a lot of different things out there. It really just depends on the needs of the person. But like I said, Maxiaids, those kinds of places is a great resource just because they’ve got things you never thought of. The other thing is, you might see stuff that you can go buy at the Walmart, or the big box store, that you never thought, “Hey, this could maybe be beneficial to me depending on the challenges I’m having with independently cooking and eating too.”

Yeah, I think this question was twofold. It was about cooking and eating. And we have two phenomenal utensils in our lab there, that during our open house I had people that were asking questions about, and I learned that I really wasn’t that familiar with them, but I was able to go find someone that was. But also, I found on Amazon a place called, and I don’t know if I’m going to say it right, so I’ll spell it. It’s C-E-L-L-E-Y and I guess I would pronounce that Celley Utensils. And they have all different kinds of utensils to help individuals with different eating abilities.

And then also we can’t not mention The Blind Kitchen as we speak about this. We had this lady at one of our all days, if I remember correctly, come in and do a demonstration. She offers all kinds of adaptive tools and tips and tricks for individuals who may be blind, or low vision, but want to safely be able to cook. And let me reiterate too, how important safety is when you’re trying to cook, especially if you happen to have to do it in a different fashion.

So, theblindkitchen.com is her website. She has a store there onsite, where you can order different things, and I’m sure if you have questions, she’ll be happy to answer those. She has a Frequently Asked Question section on there, and a different library that’s available. So Amazon, you can look for the different utensils, and then theblindkitchen.com to get some tips and tricks and see a list of different things that she suggests and offers.

And I would also just throw out there, if you’re looking, don’t know even know where to get started, I would also talk to your primary physician and ask for an OT evaluation. Occupational therapists can really help in this area, specifically with adaptive kitchen tools. Josh, you’ve mentioned different types of utensils. Belva, you mentioned a few as well, but like rocker knives, or universal cups, or jar and bottle openers, or just simply having Dycem so that your bowls and plates don’t slide around the table very much. And so there’s a lot of things that they could do. There’s also those adaptive cooking appliances, the One Touch can openers, large button or talking microwave ovens, cooktops, those kinds of things.

A couple other places I’ve also found, you can go to Amazon as well, some different places have little shops set up on Amazon. And so things like if you go in there and you search for Good Grips, you’re going to find lots of utensils or knives or other types of kitchen utensils that have bigger grips. And that’s great for folks who have arthritis, or different types of gripping issues. Ableware, OXO, Sammons Preston, those are all OT types of devices, and things that your OT would be able to point you toward, but you can see those on Amazon.

Again, if you’re getting an OT evaluation, they’re going to help pick out specific tools for your specific needs. And so I would encourage you, if you have health insurance and you have a primary physician, talk to them about getting an OT evaluation.

Also mentioned here in our data library, we have lots of different types of devices. If you’d want to set up a demo, you can give us a call. We could bring some of those things out, based on your situation and demonstrate some of those things to you. I will say, a lot of the kitchen stuff that we have, we don’t really loan to anybody, but we can certainly do a demo, and we don’t loan it because of hygiene and making sure that we’re not spreading germs and doing those types of things. But you could at least get a demo, and see how it works, and at least have kind of a hands-on demonstration with that stuff. But to do that, you can go to our website, eastersealstech.com and request a demonstration. So if you go to our services, you’ll be able to dig down to Device Demonstrations or Loan Library, and be able to schedule that with someone here on our team.

And also while you’re on the website, if you go to our other podcast, Assistive Technology Update, on episode 698, we had Doug Katz who talked about the NuLu knife, which is an adaptive knife, a rocker knife, Brian, like you were talking about. And then on episode 712, we had Matt Kawecki, whose name I probably just mispronounced it, I’m sorry, with the totchop, which is the same idea, but it actually, if I remember correctly, came with a little plate that was inverted. So you could one handed, throw your food in there and then use the knife. It would actually hold it and allow you to do everything one handed, not slip all over the place, and be able to help out too. So there’s a few podcasts on our other one talking about some adaptive cooking devices as well. As well as we also have an episode with the Brava Oven and some other stuff. So you can find more information on that show, wherever you get your podcast or at eastersealstech.com.

We’ll say also in our library, or in our, I guess this is also something that we can only demonstrate, but in our lab, we have the Obi Robot. It’s a self feeding robot, which is really cool to watch it work. Basically, it allows you to be able to scoop up food from four individual trays. You can mix those, move things around between the different trays. So if you have the mashed potatoes and peas, you can pick up a scoop of peas, move it over to your mashed potatoes, dump it into the mashed potatoes, and then take a scoop of the mashed potatoes and peas, and be able to feed yourself. And so it’s called the Obi Robot. And really, really interesting for folks who really don’t have any physical ability to interact with a utensil, a knife, a fork, a spoon, those kinds of things. This would allow you to be able to at least use a spoon to be able to pick up different types of foods and then have the independence to be able to feed yourself. And so, I’ll throw that one out there as well.

Well, hey, I’d love to open this up to our listeners. If you guys have any feedback on adaptive kitchen tools, or for cooking, or eating, that would be really helpful to hear more about different sites, or different devices that you have used in the kitchen. You can give us a call on our listener line that’s 317-721-7124 or send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org. Thanks so much.

All right, so our next question is, “Can you recommend assistive technologies that support students with learning disabilities in reading and writing?”

So, I don’t really have any specific apps to go along with this one, but I’m just looking at abilities to get some help with your reading and writing. And if you’re using a tablet, or if you’re using a PC, you’ve got things already built in there that can help with both your reading and your writing.

So if it’s a Windows PC, you’ve got the ability to have in Microsoft Office, different documents and things read aloud to you. So, if the reading problem is just maybe not being able to read the words, then hearing the words might be good. But if it’s comprehension that’s the problem, then having it read to you might be helpful, might not be, I’m not really sure about that. But I would say to start with the ability of having things read to you, and that’s free part of Microsoft Office. I’m having trouble thinking of exactly what it’s called right now, but if you go to Review on your menu, and click on that menu option, you’ll see the-

Isn’t it Read Aloud?

Read Aloud, yes, that’s it. Imagine that, right? But yes, that’s free part of Microsoft Office, and can also work with your emails. And then dictation also free with your Microsoft Office, or Microsoft period softwares. So then you can, rather than having to physically write, you can dictate your information. And on a tablet, it’s the exact same thing with the iPad. You’ve got the ability to have voiceover read it to you, and then you also have the dictation.

Now again, if physically writing isn’t what you mean by writing task, and there’s other areas that need to be addressed, then maybe just dictating isn’t the solution. But those are two free places that I would definitely start with, to see if they’re enough to do what you’re needing. And then depending upon what school you’re at, and I don’t know, Josh, Brian, you guys both help me, but don’t most of the colleges still offer Read&Write for free, for most of their students, which is a program that does help individuals with both reading and writing. And if you’re getting it through the school, then there would be no cost for that. It used to have a cost involved with it, but I think most of those schools offer it, or some of the schools do offer it for free.

Yeah, there’s-

Am I wrong about that?

I don’t know. It’s been a little while since I’ve been connected to that. But I do know a lot of schools in Indiana had started offering Read&Write. It’s a program that’s offered. The manufacturer is called Texthelp. They had been doing Kurzweil 3000. Kurzweil got too expensive, and they moved to Read&Write because it’s less expensive. Those are text to speech software, or TTS software programs. They basically read text aloud, digital text aloud to support comprehension.

Also used a program that’s a lot less expensive than either of those two. Now those two offer a lot of different tools, a lot of different functionality. NaturalReader is a simpler program. I think you can download that for free. There’s a free version, but if you want to pay for it, I think you can get a pretty good version for about $99 that’ll convert PDFs and other types of Word documents and whatnot into something that it can read. You can also read things online. So NaturalReader would be another one that I would look at as well. So Josh, did you-

And with your PDFs, Read Aloud also works with those too.

Yes. And also Belva, along that lines, I think Microsoft Word Online offers a couple things, and so does the local version of Word. You can do Read Aloud just to read the document, or you can do Immersive Reader, which is actually a more sophisticated text to speech program, where you can actually make the text bigger and other kinds of things. So, I would also check out Immersive Reader. I think Immersive Reader, the read aloud is under review in your menu bar, in Microsoft Word, and if you want to get to the Immersive Reader, I believe that is in the View tab. And so, two different places for two different types of text to speech.

Yes, you’re right, Brian. It’s in the View tab, Immersive Reader.

Yep. A couple other things I’ll just mention too along the lines of what Belva was mentioning. Audiobooks are also great resources for folks for reading. Learning Ally, bookshare.org, those are both online places. I think you have to demonstrate that you have a learning disability to be able to have access to the library of digital resources that they have.

Also, reading pens, devices like the Scanmarker Reader, or the C-pen Reader would be something to look at. I’m not a huge fan of reading pens, simply because you can only scan a few words at a time, or a sentence at a time. You can’t scan a whole page at a time. So, I’d rather scan the whole page and have the whole page read to me, than just a couple of words at a time, but something to look at there as well.

And also we mentioned, so reading was one part, and then the writing was the other part. For writing speech-to-text or dictation programs, things like Dragon, or Windows Speech Recognition, or Google Voice typing. There’s lots of speech-to-text programs. A lot of that stuff is built into your operating systems these days. You don’t have to buy something separate, but if you’re wanting to do anything a little bit more sophisticated, a little bit more automated, I would recommend Dragon as an option. It’s more expensive, pretty expensive these days. I’m not exactly sure what that cost is, but it’s several hundred dollars at this point. But, it is a good program, and something to think about. I think even on Apple, Apple Dictation is also available for you, so you can control your computer and type text into the computer.

Other things, word prediction software like Co:Writer or Ghotit. Ghotit is G-H-O-T-I-T. They can help with spelling, grammar and word selection. You also have graphic organizers, Inspiration Maps, Kidspiration. I know there’s a couple more adult ones that we use. Josh, what’s the one that we…

MindView?

What’s that?

Is MindView the big one?

That’s it. Yeah, there you go.

MindView, yeah.

Yeah, that’s what I was trying to think of. MindView, again, graphic organizers helping you think about things a little bit differently, a little bit more visually. Then there’s lots of different spelling and grammar aids. Grammarly, Ginger would be another one. And honestly, I think this is where AI can be a real helpful tool for folks, but there’s a fine line you’ve got to walk with AI in this arena. You can type up a paper and you can stick that paper into ChatGPT, or one of these other AI engines, and say, “Hey, can you look at this paper for grammar?” Or, “Make sure I’ve got my commas in the right place,” those types of things. Now, I would argue do not use it to write your papers, but it can certainly help you with spelling, grammar, punctuation, and those types of things, to be able to help work some of those things out for you. So, I think that is a really helpful AI piece to it.

Okay, so Brian, I think you got every answer I had, but just a few things. With the reading pens, I’m with you, you’re just doing one line at a time, but where they can become really helpful is that at least the C-pen has an exam version. So, if your accommodation is having your test read to you, and it’s on paper, you should be able to use that device as opposed to having someone looking over your shoulder reading to you the whole time. So, it can be helpful with that.

And yeah, artificial intelligence, I did have that to talk about as well, because you could also use it for summarizing for some other kinds of tools like that, when it really comes to reading. For writing, just because you talked about the mind mapping and other stuff, you could have AI help you with that. Maybe even if starting an outline. I know for some folks I’ve worked with, it seems like a lot of the problem with writing is the getting started. Where do I start? What do I do? What the heck do I talk about? So just an idea for topics, it could definitely help too.

Like you said, you don’t want it to write the whole darn paper for sure. For one thing, it may not give you good facts, and it’s cheating. It’s definitely cheating if you use it for that kind of thing. But to get you started or anything like that, it’d be good. And I believe at least as of the time this is coming out, Dragon is currently almost $700, so…

Oh my gosh.

Yeah. So it’s one of those things where, and hopefully they’re not listening, and don’t come after us, but yeah, there was just one day where suddenly it was, what was it, 300 bucks, and the next day it was $699, same version, everything else. So, I don’t know what happened there, but it definitely did jump up in price. So, hopefully that’ll come down a little bit. You’re right, it does have a lot of those automated tools, but if you’re just trying to get your words out, and just trying to dictate stuff, there’s a dictation form in Word. There’s one built into your Windows computer, your iPad, your iPhone, your Mac computer. It may not be quite as good, but unless you need those extra features, it’s probably going to meet that need at least to help you get started, and help you get everything out and put together.

I think it’s definitely worth looking at whatever tools are included with the hardware that you’re using, just for experience, and to determine whether or not you need more. And if it is more that you need, that can also help you determine what more is it that you need. I know that some of the special apps and programs and stuff, do allow you to break your sentences down into paragraphs, and highlight the words as it’s being spoken and things like that, which can be very helpful. So, start with the free stuff and try to figure out where you need to go from there, to achieve the goals that you’re trying to get.

Excellent, excellent. Well, hey, I want to open this up to our listeners. You can give us a call on our listener line at 317-721-7124. Send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org. Let us know if you have any experience in this area, and the different types of tools that you may have used for persons with learning disabilities, students with learning disabilities, that are having difficulty with reading or writing. Thanks so much.

All right. So our next question goes along with the previous question, and we already took a stab at a little bit of AI related tools, but the question specifically is, “How can AI powered tools be utilized to support students with dyslexia in academic settings?”

In my experience, and others here can contribute as well, when you think about dyslexia and the academic settings, really, we’re also talking about reading, writing, those types of things, are some of maybe the struggle areas that someone might have. And so thinking about AI tools, what types of AI tools are out there that might be helpful?

So for me, I’ll jump in there. I think all of the tools that we talked about before, there’s text to speech, there’s speech to text. So text to speech is when it reads to you, speech to text is when you dictate to the computer, and it puts your text out there. There’s lots of different reading supports. We talked about, Immersive Reader, we’ve talked about Read Aloud, Grammarly, Ginger, Co:Writer. Ghotit. Those things that we mentioned in relation to the previous question, all of those tools, or many of those tools have an AI component to it.

So when you’re asking it to summarize, or you’re asking it to read, those things are using AI to help drive some of that technology. So, maybe a little bit of what we answered in the previous question also is true for this question, because these are sometimes AI driven tools. A couple of specific artificial intelligence, or AI related apps that I’ve used in the past, help with note taking. One is Otter.ai. So, note taking is really challenging because you’re trying to focus on what the speaker is saying, but you’re also trying to write your notes. And if you have dyslexia, it’s hard to write notes. It’s hard to go back to your notes, because the words or the letters may be jumbled. It’s hard to keep up. It’s hard to stay focused. And so, sometimes using this app called Otter.ai, what that does is basically listens, and then it transcribes everything that it hears.

And there’s lots of different tools like this. Otter.ai is one of several automated note taking devices, that basically listen to what it’s being spoken, and then turns it into text. And what I do love about Otter.ai, at the end of it, once it converts what it’s recorded into text, it will also pull out keywords. And so, if it notices that words were used multiple times, it’ll actually say, “Hey, you know what? They’re probably talking about this specific topic, and so I’m going to make that a keyword, so that when I’m going back to review that text, I can click on that keyword and then basically it’ll help me jump around that recording to those different keywords throughout that hour, hour and a half conversation, or lecture, that I’ve recorded. So Otter.ai is a really powerful tool that can be helpful.

So I don’t really know, I guess I didn’t think a lot of those things that you mentioned were considered AI. To me, AI is like ChatGPT and Copilot. I consider those to be AI. But I guess you’re right. It’s the AI in the background that I’m not even realizing is really there.

Thinking about Grammarly as it’s looking at your… What it’s doing is, it’s using AI to look at what you wrote, to make sure the commas in your periods, or the grammar that you used in that particular sentence, is correct, and then offering suggestions based on that. So the whole program is not AI, but there are components of AI built into it.

And I don’t really know. It’s funny because, one of the conversations that we had over our Mother’s Day brunch was, how I really questioned what schools are really teaching my grandkids nowadays, because they’re not teaching them to write in cursive. They’re not teaching them to read and write and arithmetic the way that I was taught. And so I just question that. I don’t know how I feel about it. I don’t know. And I feel the same way about this whole ChatGPT and the whole AI thing.

I think in a way, it stops our children, or our youth, whatever, even adults, from using our mind to think, and to work things out. We just automatically look at technology to think for us, and work things out for us as solution. No one believes that YouTube video is a great learning tool more than I do. I’ve learned so much from looking things up on a YouTube video. Can that be considered a cheater’s way of doing things? Maybe, I don’t know. But I do think it stops the school of hard knocks. So, I don’t really know. I think there are a lot of ways that AI can help our folks with different abilities, whether it’s math, reading, writing, whatever it is that they’re trying to do. But I don’t know that I feel good about it. I think I’m still old, and I feel a little bit worried about it, and a little bit scared of it, I guess.

Yeah, I can see that. I was going to go with just a couple of tools that are able to really help. So Brian talked about, we talked reading and helping us with the writing, or having things read to us, but you could also have it change the font for you. Just change the size, the spacing, the coloration, the type of font. You can easily have AI do that without having to go look at the settings, or find what it is that you’re trying to look for.

You can also have a pullout information, or even summarize, so you can make sure you’re really understanding what it’s saying. So, there’s a couple of different ways that you might be able to do it without, Belva, to your point, without maybe digging as much in and cheating. Also, just to say, and just because I hear from folks, a lot of universities don’t let you use Grammarly anymore, at least while you’re on their networks. They won’t sign an agreement to say that they won’t use your data, and things like that. I don’t know the exact rules. I just know a lot of government entities and universities will not let you use Grammarly, not because it’s cheating, because they can’t tell you where the data goes once you put the information in there.

So just make sure whatever tool you’re using, if you’re using it on a government computer, a university network, or anything like that, just ensure that it is allowed to be used for those kinds of things, just because… Hopefully that may have changed, but I just know that we have had people actually reach out to us through our helpline and stuff, looking for alternatives for that just because it’s something they used, but it hasn’t been allowed unless they’ve changed that rule lately.

Well, I think it raises a whole new question about what’s cheating and what’s not cheating. Is it cheating if I ask it to do an outline for me, or is it cheating if I ask it to write my report for me? I don’t know. I think that has to really be explored and looked into. I see the commercial right now where the girl is studying, but then she asked her AI person to create a quiz for her on this test that she’s studying for, and it does. So I don’t know, is that cheating? I don’t know.

I would say if you’re using it, so in this is personal opinion, again, talk to your teacher on which one it might actually be. But, if you’re having to make a quiz, if you’re even having to help with an outline, a tutor is going to do that. Another human being is going to be able to do that. So it’s getting you there. If you’re having it write your paper, then that’s a problem. And I see it all the time. I get lots of not spam emails, or reach out emails, sales emails. And used to be, you could tell because the English was bad. Now you can just tell because they all sound the exact same. You know what I mean?

So you’re just, “Hey, write a sales email about this to someone,” and it’s spitting out all the same stuff. So, Belva, I agree with you. There needs to be creativity. I don’t understand how my older step kids are 24 and 16, and I don’t understand how I can type so much better than they can. And they’ve used computers since they were in kindergarten. And we got a computer lab when I was a junior in high school. So there’s no reason I should be able to type circles around them. And they both hunt and peck and can barely type anything. And it’s like, how in the world did they not at least learn that skill?

Now, Josh, now I bet you they can type faster with their thumbs than you can.

That is true. But man, I tell you what, they ever have a thumb injury, those kids are in trouble.

Carpal thumb.

There’s AT out there for it. We’ll find some tools to help them out.

No more carpal tunnel, it’ll be carpal thumb.

Their productivity is going dow.

Carpal thumb.

Carpal thumbel.

Carpal thumbels.

That’ll be the new kind of problem. So I’d say, because this said AI tools utilized to support students with disabilities. So I went the way of, we’ve already talked a lot about having it read to you, being able to talk to it and have it turn it into text, but maybe just manipulate the text and change it in a way, put the weighted text, or the dyslexic font, change everything to that. Or for some folks, sometimes if you just weight the first word of the sentence, it can help, or add spacing, or just highlight line by line. And where AI I think helps a little bit, at least in the moment, is that a lot of these tools are free and can do a lot of these things, whereas I may need two or three different paid programs to make them work.

Now, how long will it be free? Who the heck knows. I feel like you have to eventually make money off stuff, otherwise, why keep investing in it? But, what do I know? But, there are some different kinds of ways to maybe use it to assist, Belva, without doing all the work for you, would be where I’d say.

Yeah, it is scary. And I’ll agree with Belva on this one. People are losing their critical thinking skills, their problem-solving skills. One day you’re going to be without AI, and you’re going to have to be able to prove it to your employer, or prove it to somebody else on the team, that you have the skills to make that happen. And when you’re not connected to the internet, and you don’t have your AI chat bot tool, that may be a bit of challenge. So do not, and hopefully do not use it to replace critical thinking and problem-solving, and rely on it.

It just leads to over-reliance on that type of technology. But hey, I want to open this up. I think we talked around it. We hit a couple of different products, but would love to hear from folks, think different AI-powered tools to be utilized to support students with dyslexia, or other learning disabilities in academic settings. And so let us know if you have any feedback on that question. Give us a call on our listener line, that’s 317-721-7124, or send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org. Thanks so much.

And now it’s time for the wild card question. All right, so our next question is the wild card question. And this is a question we haven’t had any time to prepare for, but here we go. The question is, what’s one everyday product that isn’t marketed as assistive technology, but totally should be?

Everyday product? I guess this could be considered an everyday product, and I’m scared to mention it because I hope no one’s listening. I’ll whisper it.

I hope no one’s listening.

Yeah, the Ray-Ban sunglasses. Those are marketed as just smart sunglasses for the everyday person who wants to have some cool Ray-Ban glasses, or sunglasses. But what we’ve learned is since they’ve been released, is they have become a powerful tool for the blind and visually impaired community, as well as other communities, I’m sure, just because they give you the hands-free ability to do lots of things that when you’re not sighted, you’re just not able to do.

So, the reason, as you all know, that I’m excited that they’re really not marketed as an assistive technology device, is because as with many other devices, when it gets developed to be assistive technology, somebody in the background is going, “Cha-ching, cha-ching, we’re going to make a lot of money off of this, because it’s going to help all of these people with all these different abilities.” And instead, somebody was just sitting in the background saying, “Hey, let’s make these really cool-looking sunglasses and see how much money they make us,” which I’m sure they’re making a lot of money either way, but that’s my main reason, is just because I think once they figure it out, the price on them will probably go up. I don’t think they’ll ever hit the price point that some of the other glasses that are intentionally invented for folks that are visually impaired… I don’t think they’ll ever hit that price range, but I do think that they probably will go up. So, that’s my thing, the Ray-Ban meta smart glasses.

Belva, I’m going to guess they won’t go up. And the only reason is because I think enough people will buy them. I think that’s why AT is so darn expensive, because if I’m making something solely for people with this need, I got a very small market. I got to make at least my margins back, my R&D, all that kind of stuff. Not making excuses, trust me, I’d much rather that everything be in that kind of cost thing. And I think if they take off, and become even more adaptive, and are even able to help in more ways, other companies will have to adjust, and maybe look at, “How do I make my assistive devices more every day, as opposed to just for everybody?” So hopefully, that’ll help in that way.

Man, that’s a hard one. It’s a real hard one. Is my cell phone cheating? Because I feel like my cell phone is a completely adaptive device. I don’t have to put apps on it anymore. I can talk to it. I accidentally turned on the artificial intelligence, and now every time I say, “Hey, you know who,” it’ll sit there and answer almost any question I have. And it knows context. So then if I ask it a follow-up question, it remembers what I asked the minute before. If I have atypical speech where I can’t pronounce words, it’s smart enough to figure out what the heck I’m trying to say.

I know those are adaptive things built in there, but just it’s amazing how many tools are built into my cell phone, and not just Apple. For the longest time, I would have said, go with Apple no matter what. But even Android has so many just built-in things that help a lot of folks. Think of the magnifier with the light on it. How many people… I haven’t been to a restaurant that’s low lit in years where someone doesn’t have out their cell phone reading the menu, because the print’s small, it’s bad lighting, and it helps everybody.

And I see people use cell phones with everything, that can’t move much more than their eyes, or that have no vision, or hearing left, or maybe cognitive impairments, all kinds of different things. So, there are adaptive tools in there, but really it’s a mainstream device that almost everyone has. And Belva, like with the smart glasses, you don’t stand out in a crowd. You can be using these things as an adaptation in class, at work, anywhere, and you look like everybody else. Everybody else is doing the exact same thing, or using the exact same kind of device. So you don’t really look any different. You’re doing the same thing as everyone.

That’s right. And Josh, you’re a hundred percent right about why the glasses may not go up, and why the cell phones aren’t 10 times more expensive than they already are. Because, when I went to Freedom Scientific, 25 years ago, to get certified as a JAWS trainer, I said to myself when I knew I was going, “Man, I can’t wait to get there. I’ve got one dying question.” And my first question was is, “Why does JAWS have to be so expensive?” And you know their answer? Their answer was, “Because we’re not in every household. Microsoft Office is in every household. JAWS is only in a small number. So that’s why, plus we have to continually support it and grow it.” So when he gave me that answer, I was like, “Oh, that makes so much sense.” You’re probably a hundred percent right on that.

Yeah. Well, and I think even today we talked about smart speakers. We talked about a lot of different things that are out there, that they aren’t intended for people with disabilities. They’re intended for everybody. It’s your smartphone, it’s the, what do you call the glasses? I can’t think of them.

Yeah, the Ray-Ban.

Ray-Ban.

The Ray-Ban?

I totally like that.

What did you call them? Godfather?

Yeah. But smart speakers, apple Airtags, all of your smart home devices, those are never specifically marketed to folks with disabilities per se, because that market is so small, they’re trying to sell a lot of product. And so they’re marketing it to the masses. And then what happens is, you, me, all of us here, that think about people with disabilities, and the challenges they may have with independence in their homes, at school, at work, and those kinds of places, think about, “Man, that thing over there could really help solve an issue over here.” And then we start taking these things from the mainstream and putting it into a specific situation. And we’ve got a really great solution for someone who’s really struggling in some way, shape, or form at their work site.

So one of those real examples for me, this is from years ago. There was something, it’s probably not an everyday product, but it was called the Bogen Magic Arm. And Bogen Magic Arm was used on studios to be able to hold lighting. And so the big bars that go across stage lighting where the lights are hanging down, and pointed in different directions, these Magic Arms were used to be able to hold those lights.

And long ago, a person in the disability world thought, “You know what? I’m really looking for something that could really hold a keyboard, or a mouse, or a switch, in a particular place so that someone can consistently knock it, or hit it, or interact with that particular device.” And so they took this thing that was in show business for camera lighting, and applied it to, “Let’s just attach it to a desk and put a keyboard on it. Wow. Look at how well that works for folks.” And again, that’s pretty much our world. We take these tools that are made for the mainstream, and then really apply it to a disability-related situation.

And so, I think that’s a fun question to put out there. So I would love to open this up to our listeners. If you have an everyday product that isn’t marketed as an assistive technology tool, but totally should be, give us a call. We’d love to hear from you, and hear about all these different types of things. Give us a call on our listener line that’s 317-721-7124, or send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org. Thank you so much. Before we jump off today, want to give Belva and Josh a chance to say goodbye to everybody. And so Belva, I’ll start with you.

Goodbye, everybody. Thanks for all the great questions, and look forward to the upcoming questions.

Excellent. And Josh?

Until next time, thanks for listening and see you back here.

Excellent, excellent. Take care everybody. We’ll see you next month.

Information provided on Assistive Technology FAQ does not constitute a product endorsement. Our comments are not intended as recommendations, nor is our show evaluative in nature. Assistive Technology FAQ is hosted and produced by Brian Norton. It’s editorial help from Josh Anderson, Belva Smith and Tracy Castillo, receives support from Easterseals Crossroads in the Indata project. The show transcript is sponsored by INTRAC, the Indiana Telephone Relay Access Corporation. To learn more about INTRAC, go to Indianarelay.com. Assistive Technology FAQ is also a proud member of the Accessibility Channel. To find more of our shows, go to accessibility channel.com.